hai all....continuation of the previous post...
"what if I'd use "function" instead of "reasons"?
MY "logic" is simple. If you were an Ethologist, and were observing mankind and their history and evolution (or INvolution, depending on your viewpoint and values), what would you think these things exist for?
You'd have to deduct it by observed behaviors and their consequences. Minimum "mind" involvement. You'll easily find out what these behaviors are about. And what you say may well apply to YOUR own reasoning too...
So to me, what these things exist for is almost obvious. In my experience, there's not one single thing in Nature that has no function. So it's just a matter of taking the complexity of the whole and see what the function is within that "whole" frame.
Psychology as we know is just an interpretation tool to me. And sure is not as exact as we'd like it to be. No interpretation can be. But in the end, the ethologic "interpretation" is the most coherent one to me, regardless of all our mental work. Personal opinion, of course.
These things have PLENTY of interpretations, many of which are based on theories which presuppositions and postulates are at least opinable.
Look at the consequences and take away all inconsistencies and incongruities, and soon you'll be left with very few things... and you may not like them. But when all "impossibile" is taken away, what's left is, even if improbable, true... or at least truer."
now a comment from me...
"each one of us can write about love differently, at different times, as per our moods, experiences and knowledge gained...may be after 30 years from now my experience and maturity will differ and i might define it in a different way...of course, all of us would not have defined it when we were in our teens or twenties the way we define it now!
the following one was written by me some time back...
What is love?...It is a behaviour exhibited by all sexually reproducing living organisms on this earth (does this mean 'love' has 'sex' also with it. Can't love exist without sex? (e.g the love we have for our parents and grandparents). Past or present or future. No one is spared!
Organisms which multiply by asexual reproduction do not exhibit love.
we can not think beyond a young girl, boy and sex whenever we hear this word! Is it so narrow?...why we do not think about a middle aged or old man and woman who are in love?...could be spouse or not. Why we do not think about our love with pets or places of birth and growing, place of first meeting of loved ones or occasions like marriage, birth of our kids etc...
Love...it is a feeling of attachment with another person, place, occasion, or object. It is a feeling that gives happiness. So, true love can not give us sadness. Mostly we would like to leave the person, place, occasion or object which gives us sadness and we don't fall in love. Most of these, other than human beings continue to give happiness. When they give sadness also it is due to the love that we have or the sad moment only increases the love e.g pet dog falling sick."
"Human beings....wofffff!!!...They give a mixture of sadness and happiness. The sadness is due to both the people involved. Most of the sadness is caused by 'US'...our own perception...and the cognition that follows...the overall analysis of the person or situation and what we decide to do...very little is by the other person in general...
most of the sadness can be eliminated by detailed discussions...open, heart-out discussions...even such discussions are soothing and calming...they give tremendous oppurtunity to explore the people involved and the relationship...it brings lots of clarity about the images formed in the mind of the other person about us...clears mists...
some issues may not get sorted out in just one sitting...they need more sittings...both need to have lots of patience, maturity and empathy...both need to put themselves in other's shoes and see the situation or person...adapting to the situation / person ensures the relationship to continue...rigidity results in losing the person and the relationship...some are strong enough to take the loss...some are not!...they end up their lives!!!
some think their decision is right at that moment. Later they realise that it is wrong. Decision taken in haste. But many are unable to reconnect as the damage is already done beyond repairs!
At the heat of the moment we may not be able to take a right decision whether to have the person in life or to continue the relationship. So, it is better to give it some time before deciding. It is better to take that decision after detailed discussion and analysis. May be discussing it with a person whom you can rely, who can keep things confidential etc."
Most of them take their crucial decisions in love and relationships when they are angry....hot...unstable (thinking stable!)...anxiety struck...have too many things in hand to deal with...busy...in a hurry...so, it is better to tell the other person with a hug and kiss 'Honey! let us not discuss this now! we will discuss it later!'...or whenever you find an occasion where things are moving to a sadness or both of you are likely to have fights, shouts or dangers it is better to decide to leave...call it a day....give it a cool thinking...before any decisions...
may be if you feel you are wrong or you could have handled it better then you can call up and say sorry or tell it through another person...or send a msg or show any sign of sorry e.g sending a small gift.
most of the fights between lovers or couple is due to 'FRUSTRATION THAT EMERGES DUE TO UNFULFILLED 'WANTS' OR 'NEEDS'...I.E EXPECTATIONS...so, it is again and again coming to 'expectations' and 'possessiveness' which are the biggest killers of relationships!!!...if we can over come these, then we will never lose people and relationships!!!!!
Most of the strains in relationships occur due to what is called 'ego'...i.e who is great or big...COMPARISON...the damn idiotic cultural trait that we have imbibed!...most of the lovers, husbands and wives ruin their lives with this...with the feeling 'who is big, you or me!'...'why should i do it. Why not you do it!'...it is the gandhian philosophy which will win always...pure love and compassion...throwing away all the social or organisational positional authorities, educational qualifications, the fame, the wealth, the power, the authority at home, in short 'all resources'!...throw away all this shit and just feel that 'we are two hearts in a relationship'. 'I love you. you are important to me. Nothing can come in between us!'...that is all...if both of them take up the relationship with this feeling then it will live for eternity. If only one of the two has this, then it may not last long. ONLY LOVE CAN KEEP THE LOVE INTACT. LOVE ONLY WINS LOVE. if it does not win then the other person is not worth your pure love!!!
May be taking a third person who is a (real and matured) good friend of both for the moderation will work out, as in most of the cases 'what we think as right might be wrong! and what we think as wrong may be right!'"
"What happens, a lot, is that people's expectations are far too high of the "other" when entering a marriage/partnership.
Of course, this happens, a lot, when one spouse has NPD. S/he idealizes the"other", and then when s/he discovers the "other" is simply a human being, the devaluation sets in."
bye....
rams
"what if I'd use "function" instead of "reasons"?
MY "logic" is simple. If you were an Ethologist, and were observing mankind and their history and evolution (or INvolution, depending on your viewpoint and values), what would you think these things exist for?
You'd have to deduct it by observed behaviors and their consequences. Minimum "mind" involvement. You'll easily find out what these behaviors are about. And what you say may well apply to YOUR own reasoning too...
So to me, what these things exist for is almost obvious. In my experience, there's not one single thing in Nature that has no function. So it's just a matter of taking the complexity of the whole and see what the function is within that "whole" frame.
Psychology as we know is just an interpretation tool to me. And sure is not as exact as we'd like it to be. No interpretation can be. But in the end, the ethologic "interpretation" is the most coherent one to me, regardless of all our mental work. Personal opinion, of course.
These things have PLENTY of interpretations, many of which are based on theories which presuppositions and postulates are at least opinable.
Look at the consequences and take away all inconsistencies and incongruities, and soon you'll be left with very few things... and you may not like them. But when all "impossibile" is taken away, what's left is, even if improbable, true... or at least truer."
now a comment from me...
"each one of us can write about love differently, at different times, as per our moods, experiences and knowledge gained...may be after 30 years from now my experience and maturity will differ and i might define it in a different way...of course, all of us would not have defined it when we were in our teens or twenties the way we define it now!
the following one was written by me some time back...
What is love?...It is a behaviour exhibited by all sexually reproducing living organisms on this earth (does this mean 'love' has 'sex' also with it. Can't love exist without sex? (e.g the love we have for our parents and grandparents). Past or present or future. No one is spared!
Organisms which multiply by asexual reproduction do not exhibit love.
we can not think beyond a young girl, boy and sex whenever we hear this word! Is it so narrow?...why we do not think about a middle aged or old man and woman who are in love?...could be spouse or not. Why we do not think about our love with pets or places of birth and growing, place of first meeting of loved ones or occasions like marriage, birth of our kids etc...
Love...it is a feeling of attachment with another person, place, occasion, or object. It is a feeling that gives happiness. So, true love can not give us sadness. Mostly we would like to leave the person, place, occasion or object which gives us sadness and we don't fall in love. Most of these, other than human beings continue to give happiness. When they give sadness also it is due to the love that we have or the sad moment only increases the love e.g pet dog falling sick."
"Human beings....wofffff!!!...They give a mixture of sadness and happiness. The sadness is due to both the people involved. Most of the sadness is caused by 'US'...our own perception...and the cognition that follows...the overall analysis of the person or situation and what we decide to do...very little is by the other person in general...
most of the sadness can be eliminated by detailed discussions...open, heart-out discussions...even such discussions are soothing and calming...they give tremendous oppurtunity to explore the people involved and the relationship...it brings lots of clarity about the images formed in the mind of the other person about us...clears mists...
some issues may not get sorted out in just one sitting...they need more sittings...both need to have lots of patience, maturity and empathy...both need to put themselves in other's shoes and see the situation or person...adapting to the situation / person ensures the relationship to continue...rigidity results in losing the person and the relationship...some are strong enough to take the loss...some are not!...they end up their lives!!!
some think their decision is right at that moment. Later they realise that it is wrong. Decision taken in haste. But many are unable to reconnect as the damage is already done beyond repairs!
At the heat of the moment we may not be able to take a right decision whether to have the person in life or to continue the relationship. So, it is better to give it some time before deciding. It is better to take that decision after detailed discussion and analysis. May be discussing it with a person whom you can rely, who can keep things confidential etc."
Most of them take their crucial decisions in love and relationships when they are angry....hot...unstable (thinking stable!)...anxiety struck...have too many things in hand to deal with...busy...in a hurry...so, it is better to tell the other person with a hug and kiss 'Honey! let us not discuss this now! we will discuss it later!'...or whenever you find an occasion where things are moving to a sadness or both of you are likely to have fights, shouts or dangers it is better to decide to leave...call it a day....give it a cool thinking...before any decisions...
may be if you feel you are wrong or you could have handled it better then you can call up and say sorry or tell it through another person...or send a msg or show any sign of sorry e.g sending a small gift.
most of the fights between lovers or couple is due to 'FRUSTRATION THAT EMERGES DUE TO UNFULFILLED 'WANTS' OR 'NEEDS'...I.E EXPECTATIONS...so, it is again and again coming to 'expectations' and 'possessiveness' which are the biggest killers of relationships!!!...if we can over come these, then we will never lose people and relationships!!!!!
Most of the strains in relationships occur due to what is called 'ego'...i.e who is great or big...COMPARISON...the damn idiotic cultural trait that we have imbibed!...most of the lovers, husbands and wives ruin their lives with this...with the feeling 'who is big, you or me!'...'why should i do it. Why not you do it!'...it is the gandhian philosophy which will win always...pure love and compassion...throwing away all the social or organisational positional authorities, educational qualifications, the fame, the wealth, the power, the authority at home, in short 'all resources'!...throw away all this shit and just feel that 'we are two hearts in a relationship'. 'I love you. you are important to me. Nothing can come in between us!'...that is all...if both of them take up the relationship with this feeling then it will live for eternity. If only one of the two has this, then it may not last long. ONLY LOVE CAN KEEP THE LOVE INTACT. LOVE ONLY WINS LOVE. if it does not win then the other person is not worth your pure love!!!
May be taking a third person who is a (real and matured) good friend of both for the moderation will work out, as in most of the cases 'what we think as right might be wrong! and what we think as wrong may be right!'"
"What happens, a lot, is that people's expectations are far too high of the "other" when entering a marriage/partnership.
Of course, this happens, a lot, when one spouse has NPD. S/he idealizes the"other", and then when s/he discovers the "other" is simply a human being, the devaluation sets in."
bye....
rams
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